Subject: Re: John Hagelin to debate Pat Buchanan in Maryland today March 4
Date: 03/22/2000
Author: Judy Stein
In article [AV7B4.20738$mK.1694746@brie.direct.ca],
"Jeff Ridley" wrote:
>Judy Stein wrote in message .
>Jeff wrote:
> >> Brain wave coherence was originally claimed to occur when a
> >> TMer was at the top of his jump.
> >
> >Where was this claimed, Jeff?
> >
> >I have one of the very earliest, if not *the* earliest,
> >publications of the studies on brain wave coherence in connection
> >with the flying sutra, which explicitly notes that it occurs
> >right before the person begins to hop.
> >
> >> Later the 'scientists' had to admit that it occurred just before
> >> the jump since brain waves can't be measured on a moving subject.
> >
> >There's no need for the quotes around "scientists"; the TM
> >researchers are well qualified and have excellent credentials.
> >And unless you can show me where and when the movement claimed
> >coherence occurred at the top of the hop, I say you're making it
> >up, or possibly are repeating something someone told you who
> >hadn't understood what the studies claimed.
>
> Research completed May 1977 [Scientific Research on the Transcendental
> Meditation Program, Collected Papers, Volume 1, David W. Orme Johnson, Ph.D.
> and John T. Farrow, Ph.D., eds., Maharishi European University Press,
> Livingston Manor, First Edition, 1977] From the introduction, pages 701-704:
>
> "However, during the period corresponding to a gradual lift in
> the air by the subject observed on the TV monitor . . . coherence
> rose dramatically and heart rate accelerated from 69 to 96 beats
> per minute. " (ibid., p. 709)
Hmm.
This doesn't say what you said, that maximum coherence occurs at the top of the hop, now does it?
But "gradual lift" is at best misleading, and "during the period corresponding to" is ambiguous as to the point at which it occurred.
The legend for the chart of EEG coherence and heart rate in the study says, "It can be seen from the figure above that the `lift' occurred during a period of high bilateral frontal EEG coherence," the marginally more accurate reverse of the sentence in the body of the study (the lift occurs during the coherence, rather than the coherence occurring during the lift), but the sentence continues, "which remained at a high level during the experience." As you note, this last simply isn't true because EEG can't be measured during activity due to movement artifacts.
But then in the very next paragraph, the experiences of another subject are described. The paragraph concludes, "Periods of total coherence were also found to PRECEDE `hopping' in this subject" (emphasis added).
I was working from memory when I responded to your post, since I couldn't quickly locate my copy of the book. I finally found it. That statement quoted immediately above must have been what I'd been thinking of.
Nowhere in the study, however, does it say anything about maximum coherence occurring at the *top* of the hop.
So you were in error on that point, just as I thought, and there is that one sentence supporting what *I* said. But I'll concede the other statements are ambiguous or misleading, and the part about "remained at a high level during the experience" is simply not true, so I'm willing to call this one a draw.
In any case, they *did* make the necessary corrections shortly thereafter. |
